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 Politics thread 
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Darth Fucking Vader
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Post Politics thread
A place to talk politics.

Anyone else following this Occupy Wall St. thingie?



Fri Oct 14, 2011 9:00 pm
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Darth Fucking Vader
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Post Re: Politics thread
"New" found? ;)


Fri Oct 14, 2011 9:22 pm
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Space Ranger
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Post Re: Politics thread
I think it's inspiring and amazing to see the Occupations persisting and spreading across the nation; incredible that the people participating have shown such discipline/determination in keeping the protests nonviolent (despite the police), and that such momentum has gathered behind them. Personally, I thought it would get dissolved in apathy after a few days, and I'm glad that I was stone-dead wrong.

Movements like this haven't been around (here) for decades, and now that non-internet media is covering and discussing these protests/events/issues, the overall messages behind them cannot be ignored.
At this point, someone could say: "DUDE! you live 12 miles from the epicenter of American Unrest! You have no job, and every reason to go out and join the fight!". They may have a point, but while some choose direct confrontation to bring particular people to justice, my non-involvement stems from the view that the focus is upon the symptoms of a larger process that only total collapse will relieve.

OK, the Occupiers want the particular villains brought to answer for their crimes, and in the case of Raj Rajaratnam, this has come to fruition. The thing is, a hundred other hungry and unscrupulous folks will take his place and attempt the same crime. What to do about this tendency? What to do about the nuances of economics and plain human greed that provoke these actions?

The process that I speak of is the larger world economy, and the inherit imbalance within it. Simply put, as long as one person has $1, and the other has .01 cents, there will always be have-nots, and as more resources and market niches are discovered, it is self-perpetuating.
I wonder if the people who protest genocidal acts and land-grabs in Africa realize that the reason is for the extraction of rare metals to produce their laptops and phones. Do the anarchists worldwide know about the labor law advantages taken by the companies that make their clothing, outsourcing to countries that don't give a shit if their children are born deformed, just as long as some mid-level official gets gold rims on his Bentley? Hell, I'd like to know how many enlightened consumers know about Coca-Cola plants that have permanently befouled major rivers in India?

The examples are infinite, but the core is that many who protest and complain may not realize how involved and complicit they are in the injustices they focus upon. OK, say Goldman Sachs burns to the ground tomorrow - some company from Abu Dahbi or wherever will just move up and do the same thing because they fill a niche of the larger self-perpetuating economy, serving clients that provide goods and services, right down to your shoelaces.

Do we despair? Do we Fuck Shit Up ad infinitum? IMO, people can/will do what they please if they think they're making a positive change, but instead of forcing others to change, we have to change ourselves, first.

Think: how do these companies get big? OUR SUPPORT; Withdraw that support, and they collapse under their own weight. Our consumer habits, our lifestyles, our participation and submission to whatever institutions are the driving force behind Wall Street / Canary Wharf / Main Street, etc. Extract ourselves at great expense to our current lifestyles, and the justice brings itself about.

Not everyone is willing and/or capable of doing this, but it's the way I see it happening.

Myself, I'm no spotless pundit of revolution - far from it, but I'm working towards my self-extraction from this process and toward self-sufficiency as much as I care to do so. Whether it is by exploitation of the current economy, or simple non-involvement, it stems from Awareness; awareness of one's current status, dependency, and complicity, and awareness of one's options and self-determination.

/rant


Fri Oct 14, 2011 9:43 pm
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Space Ranger
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Post Re: Politics thread
on a far lighter note.....

http://www.thatvideosite.com/video/racist_field_trip


Fri Oct 14, 2011 10:10 pm
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Storm Trooper
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Post Re: Politics thread
couldn't give a shit about politics

possibly why I'm a Lib Dem who votes Tory

(fuck u'all!)


Sat Oct 15, 2011 12:08 am
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Post Re: Politics thread
FIST EGG

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Enos wrote:
chowing down on a beefy log


Sat Oct 15, 2011 12:13 am
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Post Re: Politics thread
Morf wrote:
Are you drunk, Stevil?

Shouldn't you be wandering around your bedsit listening to Deep Purple on vinyl in your pants? Isn't that what all tr00 Black Metallers do?


You know me too well!

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Enos wrote:
chowing down on a beefy log


Sat Oct 15, 2011 12:20 am
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Post Re: Politics thread
Morf wrote:
Shakin' Steev-unz wrote:
possibly why I'm a Lib Dem who votes Tory


*Insert punchline here*


As in "That's what Nick Clegg is/does"

Clegg sold out the Lib Dems (even before the coalition), so I'm a Tory until a cunt with balls takes over the LD's and get's them back on track


Sat Oct 15, 2011 12:25 am
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Darth Fucking Vader
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Post Re: Politics thread
I would set up a Wizardocracy, run by me. RS teachers and Live Role Players would automatically be lower caste.


Sat Oct 15, 2011 12:41 am
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Space Ranger
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Post Re: Politics thread
The Terrible Weasley Brothers drag you to their Bunny Dungeon.


Sat Oct 15, 2011 1:11 am
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Star Trooper
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Post Re: Politics thread
me i am a working class male from Wigan its old labour all the way in my house.....................


Sat Oct 15, 2011 2:09 am
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Space Ranger
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Sat Oct 15, 2011 2:12 am
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Star Trooper
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Post Re: Politics thread
robitusson wrote:
A place to talk politics.

Anyone else following this Occupy Wall St. thingie?



I'm keeping half an eye on it.
Wanted to go to Occupy Manchester last Sunday, but was too ill, want to go to Occupy London today, but have a once in a lifetime opportunity to meet a Continuous Cover Forestry luminary.

Will it all fizzle out? Will it make the difference it hopes too? Changes can be slow and gradual. Reminds me of the Carnival against Capital, J18.
Will it turn violent? Err, it already is, I saw what those cops did.

We it be used as a excuse to round to dissenting voices?

As a movement, it seems to lack a coherent politic message, there are anarchist voices, but they are a minority, there are unionists, there are reformists, but all are united by a sense of injustice. There was at least one statement issued by them.
http://current.com/shows/countdown/vide ... all-street

Milling about won't persuade the fuckers trading futures to stop and change their ways, but it does create a space for political discussion and high light once again the state's involvement in defending corporate criminality.


Sat Oct 15, 2011 7:19 am
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Post Re: Politics thread
robitusson wrote:


What amazing hypocrisy shown in this video.


Sat Oct 15, 2011 7:35 am
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Post Re: Politics thread
I don't like the apartheid that is going on in Wales, it sucks.

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Sat Oct 15, 2011 11:13 am
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Darth Fucking Vader
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Post Re: Politics thread
Morf wrote:
What would the punishment for spells/phrases from Harry Potter be?


Death by sodomy.


Sat Oct 15, 2011 11:35 am
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Darth Fucking Vader
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Post Re: Politics thread
Beermoth wrote:
I don't like the apartheid that is going on in Wales, it sucks.


Cymry/Sais or Cymraeg speakers/anglophones?


Sat Oct 15, 2011 11:36 am
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Post Re: Politics thread
Dastardly Dr Dee wrote:
Beermoth wrote:
I don't like the apartheid that is going on in Wales, it sucks.


Cymry/Sais or Cymraeg speakers/anglophones?

All of it. It is wrong to comment further on it, being as I'm an observing commentator and not fully aware of the facts but it appears People and business are leaving Wales because of it. I think it is great that Wales wants to save it's language but making business print everything in two languages is silly. Business are finding it expensive to do the duel language thing, you have to get it the translation done by someone qualified to do so. There also seems to be a requirement to have to speak or agree to learn Cymraeg to get a job. Also there is becoming a sort of them and us mentality that even natives find themselves on the wrong side of. I thought we were past all this.

I would really like you to tell me I'm wrong and that all is well, because from my point of view it don't look good. :(

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Sat Oct 15, 2011 12:24 pm
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Darth Fucking Vader
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Post Re: Politics thread
They are two seperate issues, though overlap. To out it in context, there are 3 million people in Wales and around 500,000 of those were not born in Wales, 90% of that 500,000 are English. You can imagine how the Daily Mail/Tory/EDL/Home Counties?English in general would react to 1 in 6 people being outsiders within England. On top of this England is the dominant culture and the Welsh are despised and reviled.

Many cpmparatively welathy English move to poor but pretty areas and treat the locals like shit, their attitiude to the Welsh language is not disimialr to the attitudes of white settlers in the US or Australia. Towns and villages become tourist and "immigrant" focused, prices of everything goes up and the already marginalised locals are simply shat on.

There are of course English people who integrate and I'm not tarring everyone with the same brush. It will get to the point where ever more put upon and desperate locals in these areas may start attacking or even killing tourists or people who have moved in, it would potentially cause all sorts of esculations and the situation of Welsh people living in England would get ever more uncomfortable. It would highlight the extremity of the issue and I wouldn't look at such retaliations as being entirely negative in themselves, they are one of the few ways people in such situations can make themselves heard. City dwelling Sais are not going to listen to the grievances of the ethnically unfashionable and backwards sheep shaggers.

As to the language issue, you're completely right, most Welsh people don't speak Welsh, yet a disproportionate amount of jobs ask for Welsh speakers, often becuase they legally have to have at least one bilingual member of staff. It's created a club of Welsh speakers who are at an advantage over everyone else. I don't mind council/govt signage being bilingual or big businesses, it's too much for smaller ones.

My dad got a brouchure of adult courses in the local area and it's twice as long as it would normally be, because all the information has to be duplicated in both languages, that's council run so fair enough but it gives an idea of the effect this is having. There are virtually no native Welsh speakers locally and most or all of the Welsh courses in the brochure are for beginners or relative newcomers.

Many graduate type jobs in Wales now ask for Welsh speakers, there weren't many such jobs in the first place; I haven't seen any stats but I'd imagine evenmore graduates are leaving Wales, and whereas previously many may have returned when they were a little older to start families and settle down, that option may no longer be there.

I've seen displays in the museum in Cardiff with Welsh above and bigger than English, this snubs all "foreigners" and most Welsh people; the automatic announcements on the tannoys in Cardiff Central Station are in Welsh first, then English. The wait for the English (all stations are mentioned in both languages, evenwhere they are the same words) is long enough that you could miss your train.


Sat Oct 15, 2011 12:52 pm
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Post Re: Politics thread
See, it sucks big ones.

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