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 Phil Anselmo (racism in metal) 
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
FeedMeVibration wrote:
Myrddin wrote:
That isn't to say there aren't thick liberals, or hypocritically racist ones, just there's a lot more of them on the right wing.


Depends on how you define thick. Depressing as it is, I'd suggest the most dangerous 'thickness' exists within much of the modern New Left. They think they are thinking these days, but have been stripped of critical faculty and crucially nuance; turning debate into nothing more than fallacy-spotting by way of points scoring, and feeding on a smug entitlement in lieu of caring to solve problems.

That's a dangerous space to occupy.


That's why I said earlier that Anselmo and people like him are sitting ducks. The 'new left', however, consider themselves to be 'enlightened' and proclaim to do things for the purpose of achieving 'social justice'.

At least with the racist you know where you stand.


COSMIC: Anselmo is a bit of a loon and always has been. Just listen to the way he talks for fucksake!


MYR: If you really want more info just PM.

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Sat Jan 30, 2016 11:59 am
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
robitusson wrote:
Myrddin wrote:
. That isn't to say there aren't thick liberals, or hypocritically racist ones, just there's a lot more of them on the right wing.

The default position on the liberal left is to make excuses when non-whites, non-males, non-anointed-persecuted-groups do something harmful, stupid, damaging, etc. This is a deeply racist proposition. It's incredibly pervasive.

Ironically the opposite, ie. assuming people make choices out of character and not because of their skin-colour or whatever else, is now a characteristic of the conservatives or the right, especially in America.


And what is "character", if not the some total of your experiences, many of which will be determined by your skin colour, wealth, gender, religion etc? It's also biology but that's a distant second other than with people with substantial brain anomalies i.e. autism and psychopathy.

I agree that kne jerk liberalism is a problem, it's one I encounter constantly hanging out with hand wringing, metropolitan lefties all day. I would question the actual liberality of many of those people to be honest.

Depends on what you mean by excusing? Doesn't it? I do agree it exists and can be extemely patronsing and frankly inverted racist but it can be an unfortunate offshoot of a positive intention to understand other people.


Sat Jan 30, 2016 12:11 pm
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
FeedMeVibration wrote:
Myrddin wrote:
That isn't to say there aren't thick liberals, or hypocritically racist ones, just there's a lot more of them on the right wing.


Depends on how you define thick. Depressing as it is, I'd suggest the most dangerous 'thickness' exists within much of the modern New Left. They think they are thinking these days, but have been stripped of critical faculty and crucially nuance; turning debate into nothing more than fallacy-spotting by way of points scoring, and feeding on a smug entitlement in lieu of caring to solve problems.

That's a dangerous space to occupy.


I agree, I constantly meet people who are mindful of accruing Guardian Reader Tolerance Points in fucking games of social one-upmanishup.


Sat Jan 30, 2016 12:13 pm
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
Vim Fuego wrote:
Varg Vikernes is still alive and a bit on the fascist side. He doesn't make very good music though.

Ho ho ho, never missing an opportunity to take a shot. :x

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Sat Jan 30, 2016 12:22 pm
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
Myrddin wrote:
And what is "character", if not the some total of your experiences, many of which will be determined by your skin colour, wealth, gender, religion etc?

Well, imo this is the determinist/ racialized/ gender-ised/ classist view that I would say characterises the liberal/ left today. Those things have some influence maybe (wealth definitely), but I would see character as something personal and individual, which I suppose is the more right wing view........at least it is now anyway. The left used to represent this liberal view of the individual before, and the right used to represent the more racialised or certainly a nationalistic one.

Anyway, this is why imo an idiot doing a fascist salute means zip, because racist and racial ideas with real influence and real authority are increasingly coming from a paternalistic and authoritarian left.


Sat Jan 30, 2016 12:27 pm
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
Stat_Rad wrote:

This idea that racists are not intelligent people really needs to stop right now. It's such liberal bourgeois nonsense. Most of the racial theories came from the intellectual class, not the peasantry, and the 'academics' behind the white nationalist project aren't dummies at all.



This. The white supremacist commnity has always had (and still does) have a core of smart individuals who are highly skilled at presenting the usual ages-old crap as if it's genuine, insightful and common sense. Besides, the radical right are quite good at appropriating the terminology of the left to advocate their ideas. Does anyone remember Nick Griffin's endless references to British people as "indigenous" or the "rights for whites" campaign?

Would anyone be willing to dismiss Marine Le Pen as another thicko? Or the middle-class neo-nazis in Germany? Or the people who act as lawyers for them in their inevitable slew of court cases? Intelligent racists and bigots exist today, it's just they have enough sense to hide their views in public.

That said, it's a common thing to think people who don't believe the same things as you are utter morons. It's why the right make such a big deal out of tumblrnauts and the UK left make such a big thing out of Ukippers saying stupid things. Why argue for your position when
you can just dismiss them as dummies?

For all this talk about the metal community tolerates racism, the overwhelming response to this as far as I've seen from the metal "community" at large is "God, is Phil still being a retard again?" Or is this just me?


Sat Jan 30, 2016 1:08 pm
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
Phil is drunk and an idiot.

Internet cacophony of "down with this horrible racism".

Return volley of "liberal leftwing pointscoring nonsense".

Repeat in about 5/6 weeks time.

Ian Stuart > Hitler > Agatha Christie > Anselmo.


Sat Jan 30, 2016 2:28 pm
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
A lot of this is about whether or not the culprit in question is considered a safe target, I suspect.

PA's music and persona has always split opinion 50/50 among metal fans, which is why both the attacks on *and* the defenses of him are currently equally vociferous. As Robb Flynn seems to point out, if an ultra-easy target like J. Bieber or the Nickelback guy said something similar, there'd be far less whingeing about PC-ness and SJWs, because the attack on them would be almost total.

He is a knob and, seemingly, a wholly unmanageable drunk, that much is clear.


Sat Jan 30, 2016 3:15 pm
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
Guy Incognito wrote:
Ian Stuart > Hitler > Agatha Christie > Anselmo.


Where does Varg fit into that?

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Sat Jan 30, 2016 4:57 pm
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
Baphomet wrote:
Vim Fuego wrote:
Varg Vikernes is still alive and a bit on the fascist side. He doesn't make very good music though.

Ho ho ho, never missing an opportunity to take a shot. :x


So I point out he's fascist and you pick up on that? Interesting....

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Sat Jan 30, 2016 6:57 pm
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
I am not offended by what Anselmo said because he's just a scared white man, drunkenly blurting out his fears. By not being offended I am not corroborating or agreeing with the viewpoint, I am just emphasising how pathetic I find it. As pointed out in numerous posts thus far the man is a known "knob", so let's not fall down flat arsed and jaws agape at this outburst.

He's a "has been" most certainly and the issue of anyone agreeing with him isn't a "new" threat in the metal community as I suspect there are far more influential racists out there able to preach their irrational hatred to interested ears who already like one or more particular forms of music. It's hardly as if anyone of value to the world is now going to think Anselmo is right just because they own a copy of "Vulgar Display Of Power".

Flynn is right to distance himself from it all.


Sat Jan 30, 2016 7:12 pm
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
What does get frustrating when it comes to race is the almost overwhelming sense of entitlement from blacks here in the DC Metro area. Also, it gets frustrating when the race card is used during criminal proceedings, and how policemen are extremely paranoid and frightened about the idea of maybe having to use their weapons. There is a strong sense of elitist beliefs in the left. It seems to be more of a case of intolerance between social classes than one of racism. I see this almost everyday where I live. It's ironic that paternal racism of the old south has migrated to the north, and the competitive racism (more extreme form of racism based on resentment and hate) of the old north has now migrated to the south.

I'm not defending Phil's remarks. They have no place in society whether he was joking or not. Flynn's response is spot on, imo. He might be piggy backing to get attention, but I believe he was being genuine.


Sat Jan 30, 2016 7:19 pm
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
ajk70 wrote:
What does get frustrating when it comes to race is the almost overwhelming sense of entitlement from blacks here in the DC Metro area. Also, it gets frustrating when the race card is used during criminal proceedings, and how policemen are extremely paranoid and frightened about the idea of maybe having to use their weapons. There is a strong sense of elitist beliefs in the left. It seems to be more of a case of intolerance between social classes than one of racism. I see this almost everyday where I live. It's ironic that paternal racism of the old south has migrated to the north, and the competitive racism (more extreme form of racism based on resentment and hate) of the old north has now migrated to the south.

I'm not defending Phil's remarks. They have no place in society whether he was joking or not. Flynn's response is spot on, imo. He might be piggy backing to get attention, but I believe he was being genuine.


Your fucking Seppo pigs should be a bit more "frightened and paranoid" about using their cunting weapons as murdering people seems to be their main purpose. I am aware they kill people of all colours, they are very egalitarian like that.


Sat Jan 30, 2016 7:32 pm
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
Myrddin wrote:
ajk70 wrote:
What does get frustrating when it comes to race is the almost overwhelming sense of entitlement from blacks here in the DC Metro area. Also, it gets frustrating when the race card is used during criminal proceedings, and how policemen are extremely paranoid and frightened about the idea of maybe having to use their weapons. There is a strong sense of elitist beliefs in the left. It seems to be more of a case of intolerance between social classes than one of racism. I see this almost everyday where I live. It's ironic that paternal racism of the old south has migrated to the north, and the competitive racism (more extreme form of racism based on resentment and hate) of the old north has now migrated to the south.

I'm not defending Phil's remarks. They have no place in society whether he was joking or not. Flynn's response is spot on, imo. He might be piggy backing to get attention, but I believe he was being genuine.


Your fucking Seppo pigs should be a bit more "frightened and paranoid" about using their cunting weapons as murdering people seems to be their main purpose. I am aware they kill people of all colours, they are very egalitarian like that.


Fair point, but the fallout/aftermath is far greater if the criminal in question is one of color. It gets sensationalized by the media, and the fact of whether the use of deadly force was justified gets overlooked.


Sat Jan 30, 2016 8:07 pm
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
And sure enough here comes the grovelling....



Sun Jan 31, 2016 7:07 am
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
Vim Fuego wrote:
Why are all the Aussies not offended?



We're too busy getting drunk and wrestling wild animals.


I'm told Graveland are "racist". It's never stopped me from buying their records though. I can't really decipher any racist rants in their music anyway - so for now I think I'll just let it be. Best just to let sleeping dogs lie and all that.

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Sun Jan 31, 2016 7:53 am
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
robitusson wrote:
And sure enough here comes the grovelling....



... And out comes the sad puppy face. Of course, the biggest thing missing from that is an actual explanation: We all get drunk from time to time, we all have heavy conversations, we all joke around, and yet we don't all go around shouting "white power", seig heiling

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Sun Jan 31, 2016 10:14 am
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
Dr Yail Bloor wrote:
Darker the better when it comes to tea, personally.


White tea vs Black tea poll?

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Sun Jan 31, 2016 10:25 am
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
Myrddin wrote:
And what is "character", if not the some total of your experiences, many of which will be determined by your skin colour, wealth, gender, religion etc? It's also biology but that's a distant second other than with people with substantial brain anomalies i.e. autism and psychopathy.


Sum, perhaps.

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Sun Jan 31, 2016 10:27 am
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Post Re: Phil Anselmo (racism in metal)
http://www.blabbermouth.net/news/dimebags-girlfriend-accuses-robb-flynn-of-masking-his-real-problem-in-wake-of-white-power-uproar/?fb_comment_id=853645734748360_853858671393733&comment_id=853858671393733#f11541d8b28d47

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